The Good - Bad / Jupiter - Saturn Debate

Date sent:       Wed, 9 Dec 1998 18:40:41 +0700 

[ Moderator's note: this letter is from the Uranian list.  In my 
opinion, it is one of the best posts on the topic of 'good and bad' 
influences, and is worthy of printing and studying.   -  Steve ] 

Referring to my previous definition of "good-bad", my further 
justifications are as follows: 

1. Jupiter alone always bring good things as given in the (book of) 
Rules, i.e. Gaiety. Contentment and happiness, Good luck, 
money, success. In combination with malefics, good or bad 
outcome may happen depending on whether smart or poor pictures 
are involved. The following meanings are taken from the rules. 
(combination between Ju and the traditional malefics including the 

Ju/Ma: Lucky deed,  = Ha: Quick, unusual death. 
Ju/Sa: Inconstant success. Successful separation. 
          Separated from luck. 
Ju/Ur: Sudden luck or misfortune if Ju is posited in poor pictures. 
Ju/Ne: Easily acquired money. Shortage of money. Money Losses. 
Ju/Ha: Lack of money. To be lucky with raw materials, 
           old materials, junk market. 
Ju/Ad: Gladly spent money. Gains out of raw materials. 

>From above it is obvious that Ju always brings goods thing to the 
combinations. In the case of poor pictures where malefics prevail, 
negative results do happen. However this is not because Ju is not 
good. You can look at the rules for the above combination replacing 
Ju with Sa to see what happen! 

2. Sa/Me is a good combination and already mentioned in the 
Rules. If you thoroughly look at the Rules you will find that there 
are some other planets when combined with the 6 traditional 
malefics may give some good happenings. However the Rules 
always give mixed results. Good or bad results again depend on 
whether good or poor pictures. If malefics prevail then bad results 
will take place. This should be considered exceptions to the 

3. In addition to item 2 above, I would like to mention what we 
were taught here which is directly concerned with the said 
exceptional cases. In Thai Astrology we have a unique combination 
of planets call "Kuu Somphon" (The Excellent Matching), where 
malefics in combination with some planets, its negative effects will be 
much reduced if  not removed or in some combination become complete 
benefic. There are four pairs of  this matching as follows: 

a) Mars and Jupiter: Mars is basically a very dreadful malefic, not 
less than Saturn as it brings all the violence up to death. But 
surprisingly in combination with Jupiter almost all the maleficent 
characters disappear leaving only  very good character of diligence, 
courage, activity, etc. All the energy of Mars is directed to beneficial 
activities. The Rules also gives the same meanings and the same complete 
removal of dreadful characteristics of Mars. 

b) Saturn and Mercury: Saturn in combination with Mercury brings 
about some good happening and less maleficent but not complete 
removal as in case of Mars and Jupiter. When Saturn is combined 
with Me, then the restriction, seriousness are directed toward 
though and make the native to be more concentrated in his 

c) Sun and Venus: Venus when combine with M  builds up too 
much passion, with Mars may cause too much sexual perversion 
(in case of poor pictures) etc. The best outlet for Venus is when 
combine with Sun resulting in beautiful body. 

d) Node and Moon: Moon is always very sensitive while the Node 
involves ties and combinations. So when the Moon combines with 
the Node, the native becomes more. Uranian Astrology says 
nothing about the excellent matching but if you look at the Rules 
you will find that the interpretations are almost the same as above. 
Moreover,more pairs can be called the "excellent matching" for example: Ad 
and Po, Ap; Ha and Ze; Ne and Pl; Ur and Me, Ju, Kr, Ap, and Po etc. This 
is the best way to use when giving advice to a native when some bad 
pictures are foreseen. For example when Saturn is crossing an existing 
picture of  Su = Po = Ma = Ur then the native should try to be involve in 
some action concerning religion to already satisfy what is required or 
else serious accident to life may happen, etc. 

4. In a planetary picture with Ju and other benefics with malefics 
where malefics are prevail. When Ju is triggered good things 
happen and the bad structure is also triggered and will happen. We 
can not blame Jupiter for this. 
For example in a picture: Ju = Sa/Ne = Ve, when a directed 
personal point activates Ju, the Sa/Ne = Ve will be activated as 
well. The native will be lucky in some issues from the activated Ju 
but also the bad meanings of Sa/Ne = Ve will also happen (in this 
case the possibility of diabetes). This example is quite clear that 
even Ju = Ve, diabetes is possible to come together with good luck 
but it has nothing to do with Jupiter at all. Also Ju+Ha-Ne 
represents tuberculosis of the lungs or  worse  cancer of the lungs. Then 
Ju is bad? 

5. In my opinion the most critical issues in life for most people on earth 
are happiness and sufferings. So broadly speaking in principle Ju 
represents happiness (good?) and Saturn represents difficulties (bad?). 
With other definitions on good bad, yes this scenario will be changed ! 

Best regards, 


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